July 7th, 2006


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12:35 am - on appropriate apparel...

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on appropriate apparel... - graffiti.maverick

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Comments:


[User Picture]From: beststephi Date: July 7th, 2006 - 07:43 pm (Link)
) The two things are mutually exclusive. Putting on a sexy outfit and making men gawk doesn't stop you from getting published. Nor does getting published make you any less sexy. Therefore, why relate them at all. Is being published more important than learning to drive? Or enjoying jazz? Or liking sushi? There's no good way to even make those relations.

I guess by "value", I meant "makes me feel good about myself", which is different from being (practically) "important", or "enjoying" something. I definitely enjoy eating sushi more than I enjoy writing.

And the two are not mutually exclusive. I purposely dress for work to be comfortable (and sexy outfits tend not to be very comfortable), because when I'm comfortable, I'm more focused and more productive.

2) I think your scale is off. By publishing, I assume you meant, like in a psychology journal. Yes, that's harder for you to do than wearing a short skirt and getting some guy walking down the street to look at you. But I publish myself on the internet all the time. That's trivial. To look at it another way. Its hard for you to get published, sure. But as I am discussing with akiramich above, Viki's goal wasn't "get men to state" it was "be a WWE Diva Search finalist." I'd argue that its far easier to get your thesis published than it is to win that, or even make it into the semi-finals.

OK, fine. That was the first example that popped into my head. But it's still true at a lower level.

You changed the definition of "easy" into "likely to happen". Sure, that's true that the probability is lower for the diva search. But I think it's more psychologically healthy basing your values on things you can control through effort rather than on some random person's opinion. Those things tend to be more stable.

I'm not saying that a person has to be the most beautiful or the most intelligent. I'm saying why not aspire to both? Venus Williams for instance, has done both modeling and has studied interior design (and owns a company that does that). And yet, I expect she'd say that winning 5 Grand Slam tennis championships was harder than either of those things.

I think you mean Serena. I wonder what she'd say she's most proud of and why.
[User Picture]From: chrismaverick Date: July 7th, 2006 - 08:47 pm (Link)
1) That's not a real correlation. I mean, yes, on some nebulous level, eating sushi may effect your work habits, but that doesn't mean that it really has anything to do with you getting published in any real manner. Also, for instance you used to think it was inappropriate for you to wear jeans to work (I know you've since changed your mind). That wasn't a comfort decision.

The other issue is that sexy doesn't necessarilly imply uncomfortable. And also, in this respect I'm not even specifically talking about being sexy. I'm not talking about whether or lot you should wear leather miniskirts and lacey corsets to work. I'm more talking about whether or not you should wear feminine, nicely tailored clothes, or ripped jeans, ratty t-shirts or dumpy poorly fitted "I'm trying to look less feminine" clothes. And I'm not even saying there is something wrong with not wanting to look feminine. That's actually fine. I'm saying that if you make that choice, then there must be a reason and "because people shouldn't pay attention to my looks" is a cop-out reason (and counterproductive, because people aren't going to say "wow, that person who may or may not be female and it doesn't matter anyway is really smart" they're going to say "wow, that person is ugly and styleless.")

2) right, but if you can control how you look. I wasn't confusing easy and likely to happen. I was trying to point out that you were equating them which I didn't think was fair. At a grand scale (winning the nobel prize for psychology vs. winning the diva search) there is just as much random chance and subjective opinion in either case. On a small scale (being a good student, being an attractive person) its much more objective and controllable. Fashion sense is plenty stable. At least as much as academic achievement. Subjective, maybe. But that doesn't make it any less real. I think I can definitively say that Cindy Crawford has much better fashion sense than Bill Gates just as easily as I can definitively say that Maya Angelou is a much better poet than Jerome Bettis. As discussed with pyrotylin above, I think its kind of a cop-out to say it isn't. Or it doesn't matter. I think that with looks, people are sensitive and so they like to pretend it doesn't matter. But you enjoy watching American Idol (and the clone shows), right? Isn't singing ability subjective on some level? But would you discourage Evelyn from wanting to be a successful singer or dancer? Then why discourage her from wanting to be a successful model or beauty queen? Is that making any sense?

And no, I meant Venus. I looked it up. I was actually going to say Serena originally, but she's a fashion designer not an interior designer, and I couldn't find any proof that she actually went to school for it (she may have, I dunno). Plus, I liked that interior design and modeling were unrelated, a opposed to fashion and modeling.
 

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