February 27th, 2007

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04:29 am - on poetry and perviness...

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on poetry and perviness... - graffiti.maverick — LiveJournal

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[User Picture]From: suicideking Date: February 27th, 2007 - 03:10 pm (Link)
Ok, I am not even going to cover the circumstances with which the poem was delivered, because I think everyone sees the "ewwww" factor in that.

I can understand a parent getting upset about this poem. It is a tad racy and while it is about being sensitive, it is framed within the context of fucking. I would say it is more graphic than Romeo and Juliet. There wasn't any oral in R&J that I remember. Also, the poem in question is in modern language, whereas R&J is in an outdated form of english that you need to translate to find anything sexual.

If you wanted to do a discussion of sexuality in poems, that would be fine. I would say you would want to get some permission slips first to cover your ass and give the parents the choice to opt their kids out of it. I would say the average parent would not be expecting a poem like this within their child's curriculum, and i think they have a say in what the school decides to expose them to.
[User Picture]From: sonbanon Date: February 27th, 2007 - 05:53 pm (Link)
I agree with everything in your reply, suicideking. (OMG! Imagine that!)

Something else to throw into the mix: most modern (and even not so modern) music is more explicit.
[User Picture]From: chrismaverick Date: February 27th, 2007 - 06:26 pm (Link)
i guess the argument is that the teachers don't give out mix tapes to their students. Still, I agree, which is why I think they're overreacting by saying that the language was too strong.
[User Picture]From: suicideking Date: February 27th, 2007 - 07:30 pm (Link)
Yeah, how the hell did that happen? I'll try and do better next time.

Mav is right about the music thing, though. schools aren't assigning NIN's "Closer" as part of students studies, that is something that they are (were) searching out on their own. Anything dolled out by the school has, by it's very nature, a differelt level of implied acceptablilty to it. So while students may be listening to more graphic music, the school isn't "condoning" it by adding it to their cirriculum... at least, they shouldn't without notifying the parents.
[User Picture]From: sonbanon Date: February 28th, 2007 - 02:30 am (Link)
NIN's "Closer" isn't the half of it when you listen to the "hip-hop" genre today, frankly. (And many other genres, that just most quickly comes to mind.)

I don't know about you, but I actively sought out erotic "literature" of any type, the school didn't have to condone it. Even so, as a parent of a child just about that age and at that grade level, I would have to raise my eyebrows if this was required reading. I guess I'd prefer something more subtle.

Yet, because I tend to see everything in the grey rather than on one side or another, I'd let her read this at home and would openly talk about it. I suppose that's the key for me: that I know about it and can talk to her about it.

P.S. Mav: who is that woman in the painting and who is it by? It's amazing.
[User Picture]From: chrismaverick Date: February 28th, 2007 - 04:16 am (Link)
I don't know who the painting is of or who did it. I did a google search for the poem on the web and that was the picture attached to it. Coincidentally, It was also on the printout of the poem that the teacher gave the kid (or at least the copy of the printout that they showed on the news) so one would assume that I found the same geocities page that the teacher did.
[User Picture]From: chrismaverick Date: February 27th, 2007 - 06:25 pm (Link)
that's fair. Though to be fair, I also had assigned reading that involved lots more explicit sex when I was her age and in clearer english than R&J. And I guess it was 10th grade, but we had to read a lot of teen romances that dealt with rape and pregancy and stuff when I was 15. There were no permission slips for any of that.
[User Picture]From: suicideking Date: February 27th, 2007 - 07:25 pm (Link)
See, I don't recall getting into anything that... graphic... until college. There was high school reading that had sexual content, but it wasn't that blunt (at least, that is how I remember it.) But to be fair, my high school was much more heavy into the sciences than the humanities, so we may have had a lacking cirriculum.
[User Picture]From: chrismaverick Date: February 28th, 2007 - 04:27 am (Link)
I wish I could remember the titles of all of the books we had to read. There's certainly less explicit sex all over the classics, R&J and Hamlet for instance, and there's off page sex strongly alluded to if not directly mentioned like every five pages of the Great Gatsby (one of my all time favorite books). I just racked my brain to come up with one of the teen fiction books we were forced to read in 10th grade and I came up with Night Kites by M. E. Kerr. It all about teen awakening and sexuality. It deals directly with homosexuality and AIDS and one of the main characters, Nicki, fucks pretty much every guy in the book. I actually remember it being pretty strong, but I read it like 18 years ago.
[User Picture]From: mamarayne Date: February 28th, 2007 - 06:05 pm (Link)
WHAT?! Why am I just now hearing about this? Ahem...ok, I'm alright now. Anyway, I would not have objected if it were a class assignment at that age. But if the pervert called you alone in to present it, that would have been a problem. Somehow, I'm reminded of a certain choir director. I'm sooooooo glad my sons couldn't sing!
[User Picture]From: chrismaverick Date: March 3rd, 2007 - 05:32 am (Link)
hey! I can sing! Just not well. You know the chior director they replaced him with also had an affair with a student, right? Left his wife for her.
[User Picture]From: mamarayne Date: March 3rd, 2007 - 05:47 am (Link)
Sheesh... that's that quality Lorain education.

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